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Concerts Recorded from Audience

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  • Concerts Recorded from Audience

    I have been using DCART32 for approximately 2 years. I use it primarily for cleaning up recordings of concerts that have been posted in various Internet forums. Most of the recordings are posted in either Windows media format or real audio format. I have not been completely satisfied with my final end product. Consequently, I thought I would list the procedure that I am now using. If anyone out there has any suggestions or improvements upon this procedure, I would be glad for the guidance.

    1) Most posted concerts can be played through Real Player or Windows Media Player. I use the program's recording feature to record the concert directly to the hard drive.

    2) During a lull in the performance (such as between songs) I can usually take a fingerprint of any continuous noise. I can then run the continuous noise filter to remove that particular noise from the entire recording.

    3) If the recording is lacking dynamics (which is often the case) I sometimes use the "punch and crunch" filter to expand the dynamics. Sometimes I use the virtual valve amplifier to add more presence to the high end of the recording.

    4) Here is where the real problem arises. Many of these recordings were made in the 70s with a portable tape recorder from the middle of the audience at the concert. It seems that no matter what I do at this point, the performance always sounds as though it is occurring from a couple of feet behind the loudspeaker. I have tried using the "front row, center" setting in the punch and crunch filter, but that does not fix the problem. I have also tried bumping up the mid range which helps a little.

    I suspect that some recordings were so poorly made that even if restored to their original condition, they simply won't sound very good. Ideally, I would like to be able to "mix" the recording, which is only possible when you have multiple tracks of information. In all of my attempts to bring vocal performances forward, I have found that I am also bringing forward any instruments with tones in the same range.

    I know that my finished product is much better than it would be otherwise. Nonetheless, can anyone suggest a better procedure or additional step that might allow me to bring the vocal to the front of the mix? This is a recurring problem, because a significant number of these recordings were made directly from the soundboard at the concert hall. At rock concerts, however, the bands typically use the public address system for their vocals instead of running them through the soundboard. Consequently, the vocals tend to be buried in the mix. Other recordings were simply made with a cassette recorded from the middle of the audience.

    I greatly enjoy the product and have recommended it to my friends. Anybody have any thoughts on how to improve my procedure? Thank you. Roy
    Last edited by Craig Maier; 03-28-2019, 03:56 PM.

  • #2
    Hi Roy -

    I've worked on a lot of these shows, and also on a number I recorded myself 'back in the day,' using a mono cassette recorder or, later on a pretty nice stereo recorder.

    If you read through all the posts here, one thing you'll find is that the common thread is the better quality you start with, the better the quality you end up with. If you're starting with mp3 or wma conversions from wav files, you're starting with loss on top of a medium that wasn't great to start with. Add a couple of generations (I've seen 7-8 generations on some shows) on the cassettes, and you're in really bad shape, so don't expect any miracles. I like to think of it as 'rearranging' what's left, which is only a small part of what was there to begin with.

    You're procedure is, I think pretty good. I would be very careful about the CNF because, even at the quiet parts, your sample will contain low level talking, tuning, etc. and you are sampling frequencies, not the actual noises, so whatever you take out is going to affect the music that exists at those frequencies. And a cheap cassette recording from 1975 or so with multiple generations won't have any real information (i.e., music) at anything but the same range as what you're sampling and reducing.

    Also, each recording is different - even if made by the same person in the same venue at approximately the same location. I have 2 concert recordings that I made in 1973, 2 nights apart, and I used different procedures on them because they have different issues - even though I was working from the master cassettes. A third master tape from the same year by a friend of mine was completely different still, but all were recordings of the same band.

    Anyway, I tend to first try to emphasize and 'bring back' whatever is there, to get the best sound possible. Sometimes a couple of VVAs in the multi-filter, sometimes the Dynamic Noise filter set on spectral expansion, sometimes the punch and crunch. You really have to experiment with a lot of options to get the best sound back. Also, a little EQ goes a long way. After I get what I think is the best sound, I worry about noise reduction.

    Good luck - it's a lot of fun and a lot of hard work.

    Dan
    Last edited by Dan McDonald; 11-30-2005, 10:08 AM.
    Dan McDonald

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    • #3
      On other thing that works occasionally to bring out the vocals or lead guitar that I forgot to mention:

      Sometimes the dynamics processor with the "enhance background sound" preset helps quite a bit. Sometimes it make things worse by bringing out the crowd noise, but other times it brings out the vocals. I just try it out to see how it does.
      Dan McDonald

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      • #4
        I just checked, and it looks like the exact name of the preset in the Dynamics Processor that Dan is referring to is:

        "Background Sound Enhancement"
        "Who put orange juice in my orange juice?" - - - William Claude Dukenfield

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        • #5
          Thanks for the suggestions

          Dan and Craig-- Thanks very much. I hadn't thought of that preset. I'll give it a try.

          One of the funny side effects of working with the software is that now whenever I listen to all but the latest digital recordings, I hear the "defects" and think about what I would change. Have a good holiday. Roy

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          • #6
            Roy,


            You could be on the road to becomming an audio perfectionist, a very dangerous disease!
            "Who put orange juice in my orange juice?" - - - William Claude Dukenfield

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