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Hi Marc,
Sure, in our spare time.
Craig
ps - - - btw - - - that CD is a very good seller
Sure, in our spare time.
Craig
ps - - - btw - - - that CD is a very good seller
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"Who put orange juice in my orange juice?" - - - William Claude Dukenfield -
First Test Results
Group,
I received the 3.75 mil Stylii today from Kurt Nauch. The part came from Expert Diamond Stylus.
Well, I tried it with the Stanton 500.V3 and some Edison Diamond Discs. I expected an improvement in surface noise over the 2.7 mil stylus. No such luck.
The 3.75 mil still records a lot of surface noise on the discs (WW1 time frame) and could just be the way it is.
I'm using about 5 grams on both the 3.75 and the 2.7 mil. Both react differently when I add some weight to the arm. The 2.7 increases the high frequency signals with the extra weight.
Note : I'm using a RIAA preamp while I'm listening.
It appears that different weight on the different stylii gives different results !
I'm confused...when I listen with the RIAA curve (I Know it should be flat), is better more noisely signal and high notes ?
Regards,
MarcComment
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Quoting Marc:
"I'm confused...when I listen with the RIAA curve (I Know it should be flat), is better more noisely signal and high notes ?"
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The RIAA curve will impart more bass to the signal and less treble. As a result, the noise will be less when played with the RIAA curve. But, the tonal balance will also be incorrect.
We recommend reversing the RIAA curve (to acoustical) using the Virtual Phono Preamplifier and then de-clicking using the EZ Impulse Filter and then de-hissing using the CNF. Lastely, you might consider using the 20 band EQ or the Paragraphic EQ to fine tune the overall tonal balance to your own taste.
Craig"Who put orange juice in my orange juice?" - - - William Claude DukenfieldComment
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Craig,
Let me try again as I wasn't clear.....
The sound I was refering to was as I was recording the music...not after processing.
I use the sound card to play back as I am recording so that I can make sure that I'm not overloading the signal.
The multifilter that I use for Diamond Disc restoration has all the features you said and much more.
Regards,
MarcComment
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Marc,
Sorry for the misunderstanding.
Craig"Who put orange juice in my orange juice?" - - - William Claude DukenfieldComment
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Craig,
No problem....I really like a face to face discussion for technical things as I find that clear discussions of a technical nature need the spoken word and a "white board" to draw out the setup. It's just the nature of things as I'm not a good writer.
I remember that you had made some comments in the past about stylus size and getting more high frequencies ? As I recall, you mentioned that the sound improvement was good and the extra "surface noise" could then be removed with the software. Do you have a reason for the extra high frequency sounds being picked up from the record?
Regards,
MarcComment
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Quoting Marc:
"Do you have a reason for the extra high frequency sounds being picked up from the record?"
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In general, I like to pick up as much of the high frequency portion of the audio spectrum so long as the S/N is greater than unity. This not only allows for the best fidelity of the final result, but provides the Impulse Algorithms as much signal / noise as possible to discriminate between transient noise and real audio on the record. With LPs, it is actually beneficial to transfer signals up to a little over 20 kHz (even though we can not hear them) as impulse functions are more accurately preserved. As a matter of fact, many folks do their transfers at 96 kHz providing them with bandwidths up to (theoretically) 48 kHz, which provides better S/N when de-clicking records.
But, I would not simply use a smaller stylus to obtain the wider response, since we are really looking for a ratio and not just an absolute value. So, I usually observe the noise as well as the signal when choosing a stylus.
BTW - - - I wrote up something a number of years ago here on the forum about stylii vs theoretical frequency response for laterally cut records which can be found at this link:
http://gator1104.hostgator.com/~edis...uency+response
CraigLast edited by Craig Maier; 12-19-2009, 12:33 PM."Who put orange juice in my orange juice?" - - - William Claude DukenfieldComment
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Craig,
So...do you think that a smaller stylus picks up higher frequencies due to the equation you sight or to better groove following due to being at a "better" place in the groove ?
Regards,
MarcComment
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Marc,
I have not completely thought it through in the Hill and Dale case, but I think that it is true with laterals. I suspect that the diameter of the spherical tip is the driving parameter for Hill and Dales (verticals). And, it is not necessarily a situation wherein the deeper that the stylus falls in the groove, the better the result. There may be dirt accululated at the very bottom of the groove which would mean that you would want to ride just slightly above that region, but I would have to think about it more to predict the frequency response of a hill and dale vs stylus size.
CraigLast edited by Craig Maier; 12-20-2009, 07:06 PM."Who put orange juice in my orange juice?" - - - William Claude DukenfieldComment
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Hummmm.......
With a vertical hill and dale, you would think that the stylus has to ride on the bottom to have the proper playback. With the needle riding on the bottom, the dirt should affect the sound as it would make the surface noise high. Yet, the surface noise on Edison cylinders isn't bad.
Seems to me that this is a good area for a lot more analysis, namely the best way to play back the Edison cylinders.
Regards,
MarcComment
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Marc,
Certainly, some good analysis using geometry and trig would be useful here. I have not done that. But, I suspect that the cross-sectional shape of a vertical cut groove is not rectangular in shape but more conical. So, if that is true, there is sphere size that would keep the stylus off the bottom of the groove and still allow for the vertical undulations to be transmitted to the phono cartridge. But, absent knowlege of the precise cross sectional shape of the groove wall, it is hard to say. It would be very useful to know what the exact geometry of the cutting lathe stylus was on any hill and dale recording.
Craig"Who put orange juice in my orange juice?" - - - William Claude DukenfieldComment
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..or you could take a hacksaw to a couple of cylinders and get a good estimate of what they're like now.Dan McDonaldComment
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. . . yeah, Dan. Just send me one of your cylinders and I promise that I will do that and report back the results! Good one. LOL!
Craig"Who put orange juice in my orange juice?" - - - William Claude DukenfieldComment
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Dan,
Well, I do have some split/broken cylinders I keep around for "show and tell".
I just might take a look.
Anyone have a good recommendation for a microscope/vision system ?
Regards,
MarcComment
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Marc,
Well, I use a Bausch and Lomb, but I think that any good microscope having roughly a total of 200 X or more would be needed. Also, it would need a good source of lighting and a calibrated reticle to do the job.
Craig"Who put orange juice in my orange juice?" - - - William Claude DukenfieldComment
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